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From: Einde O'Callaghan <einde.ocallaghan@planet-interkom.de>
Newsgroups: alt.languages.english
Subject: Re: using "an"
Date: Sun, 04 May 2008 00:36:28 +0200
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loki harfagr wrote:
> On Sat, 03 May 2008 15:12:25 +0200, Einde O'Callaghan wrote:
>
>> loki harfagr wrote:
>>> On Fri, 02 May 2008 22:15:51 +0200, Einde O'Callaghan wrote:
>>>
>>>> loki harfagr wrote:
>>>>> On Thu, 01 May 2008 11:18:21 +0200, Daniel.C wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi.
>>>>>> I learned to use "an" before a noun beginning by a vowel.
>>>>> a *vowel sound* (not like for the 'the' case ;-)
>>>>>
>>>>>> I think this
>>>>>> is correct :
>>>>>> an user
>>>>> no, the 'u' here's a special diphtong
>>>>>
>>>>>> but I read so many "a user" that I don't know what to think. Can you
>>>>>> help me ?
>>>>> I'd pronounce '"er" user' or in some circles I'd even try
>>>>> the '"ay" user', in some other circles that'll be 'a luser' ;-)
>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks in advance.
>>>>>> Daniel
>>>>> hope it helped :-)
>>>>>
>>>> It doesn't look at all helpful to me. Pierre H. has given the right
>>>> answer - the use of "a" or "an" depends on pronunciation, not
>>>> spelling.
>>> then as my answer was all about pronunciation I can't
>>> really understand your remark! Anyway, the OP seems to have read it
>>> correctly so at least I didn't totally miss my post ;-)
>> If that's the case you were also wrong - the pronunciation of the glide
>> between teh article and the noun doesn't have any trace of an "r" in it
>> at all
>
> correct, but I wasn't using IPA or SAMPA, I just used the
> closest english word "er", you know that word, don't you?
>
>> - "ah yoozer", using English orthography.
>
> Now, you certainly have an accent or a loose way to read your
> own explainations ;D)
>
I wasn't trying to use any phonetic notation other than standard English
orthgraphy - mainly because very few learners of English can cope with
ASCII IPA notation.
>> And the sound represented by the "u" is not a diphthong of any kind
>
> You're mad and/or after me and/or shocked?
>
Do you always react so hostilely to criticism of your method of
expression? Have you stopped taking your tablets? You used the wrong
linguistic term and as a trained language teacher I simply tried to
correct the false impression you had created.
Now I suggest you lie down and take a long rest until you've recovered
your composure.
>> - it
>> starts with the consonant sound represented by "y" in English and is
>> followed by a long "u" sound - even if in some linguistic texts the
>> former sound is described as a semi-vowel, it is still a consonant.
>
> You're giving too much importance to the idea of your own
> importance when you have an idea ;-)
>
> I'll admit the wikipedia is not exactly as "solid" a
> reference as could be some but in case you'd like to try
> and modify this page because their sample about the sound
> of the "u" in 'user'
> (IPA "ju", SAMPA "j}:" sample-word: "pupil")
> doesn't really fit your need to believe and make
> believe people that I'm all evil,
What gives you the idea that I think you're evil? Are you always this
paranoid? All I said was that you were wrong. Being right or wrong has
nothing to do with good or evil.
Einde O'Callaghan
> go for it:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SAMPA_chart_for_English
>
>
>> If you are going to give advice about pronunciation then please try to
>> get it right.
>
> right, and if you're in deep need to give advice about a
> given advice please try to do it without feathers.
>
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