On 21 Jul 2011 22:53:01 -0500, "Group_Troll"
<GroupTroll@Pissed.Off.nl> wrote:
>FROM: Doc NP-f31
>
>> Thank you all for your comments in the previous thread. This post also
>> went unnoticed in The Fort. Perhaps it will raise an eyebrow here...
>>
>> I got a very impressive e-mail from a friend in the groups. He raised
>> some very valid points that have been on my mind. I asked if I might
>> share his thoughts with those here and he agreed. I will present his
>> thoughts and then add my own later.
>>
>> Dear Doc,
>>
>> In the list you provide for people, you bind an unenforceable
>> agreement that the reciever will not touch boys by accepting access to
>> the material in the groups.
Hey GT-
>But many of us do what we do in private which blows the agreement away.
>I cannot say more. I post in the open.
This post elicited an unusal response from you. I don't pretend to
understand Troll thinking, but it appears that an inner battle is
raging in your heart.
What we do in private is the entire point of the post. It is also the
entire point of my unenforcable agreement. My intent is to make guys
think about their responsibilities to the boys in their lives. Some
guys have no boys in their lives currently, but they may someday.
Whenever we DO come in contact with a boy I want other BL's to think
unselfishly. That is best for the boy and it can create some amazing
experiences for the BL as well.
Either way, I am in no position to judge anyone.
>> While I have ascribed to this doctrine
>> long before I knew of your existence, your statement reenforced the
>> concept within my moral framework. A lot of people would argue that
>> the aformentioned material in itself is extremely harmful to boys (as
>> is reflected in the law), but the arguments to support that case are
>> very dubious. Hhaving access to such materialcan make relationships
>> with young friends pressure free and peaceful. Of course, like any man
>> I have sexual desire, and like any BL I have desire specifically for
>> the boys I know, but knowing that I have an outlet for that desire
>> elsewhere has allowed me to explore and fulfill emotional and
>> intellectual aspects of our relationships without the constant looming
>> threat of emotional trauma and destruction. I know I am not alone in
>> this situation, but this is something that the authorities will never
>> seem to understand, that having freely available access to this
>> material helps prevent abuse. Whatever mental gymnastics law makers
>> use to condemn posession one fact remains undisputable, looking at a
>> picture is not the same as actual touching. The real potential harm
>> from one totally eclipses the metaphysical harm waves that come from
>> the other. But enough preaching to the choir.
>I have seen both sides of this issue and there are valid points - pro and
>con - to what you are repeating, as this subject has been around for many
>years. To each man his own! What you say effects some men and boys and it
>affects other men and boys. Agin, every human is different and our
>differences can be adjustable for our public face vs what we do with boys
>in private.
I hear you and that is a knife that can cut both ways. I try to live
what I preach. I have had a good deal of success doing things that
way. I first posted about this back in 2006. Compared to now, the
paucity of material available in 206 seems like a motherlode. My
friend who wrote the original e-mail may not be a long timer.
>>
>> This leads me to the current state of the groups. Fortunately, during
>> the last few years, retention has exploded to over a thousand days.
>> This means that material that at one time vanished within 3 months now
>> remains for years, and it means newcomers and old timers alike have
>> access to a much larger pool than ever before. And even though the
>> posters began to start using encryption, their passwords and keys were
>> freely propogated by generous people and accessible by any lurker
>> willing to put in the minimum amount of effort in discovery. It seems
>> to me that this era is coming to an end.
>This era you mentioned did end a few years ago. It is now too late.
Who knows? Usenet has always been cyclical.
>> For whatever reason, groups
>> of posters have closed up shop to outsiders and no longer find it
>> worthwile to share what they are posting. I cannot blame them for that
>> decision whatsoever, as posters risk great personal safety in order to
>> provide material, so any security measures they take are de facto very
>> reasonable and perhaps necessary.
>There were several very valid reasons for posters to stop. Let's not
>repeat old shit and start fighting. Posters are gone for their own
>reasons. Fuckin' freeloaders and whiners and bitching jerks can shove it
>up their fuckin' asses! You done got under my fur. Let me shut-the-fuck-
>up!
Hehehe. You don't have to shut up. The point of this thread is for
discussion.Your opinion is as valid as anyone else's. Just remember
the original post was not my words but an e-mail I shared.
>>
>> My fear is that the push underground is going to not only increase the
>> danger to users but to the boys they are around as well.
>Has already happened!
Perhaps the situation is more dire now? My friend seems to understand
that this is so. You seem to understand it as well.
>> This
>> manifests itself in a couple of ways. One, this drying up of material
>> may push people to much more dangerous modes of transfer like p2p or
>> irc, which increases their likelihood of being caught and their and
>> their young friend's lives destroyed.
>Yep! That's what humans did. Great success on some p2p. Disaster for
>others.
It is a risk to simply 'be' a boylover.
>> Two, in desperation to gain
>> access to groups BL's will start self-producing material and trading
>> it.
>Already being done for several past years. But not in the open. Old
>posters and old-time lurkers worked agreements and went private mode or
>left usenet and went to private servers to trade/post pics. Fuck the ones
>left behind.
Yep. I understand the reasoning, but like you I think it will end up
harming boys. There is a lot of stuff still on the servers that could
be grabbed if the passwords, etc. were released. I won't hold my
breath though.
>
>> These are activities that I have never even considered
>> participating in, but I have evidence that this is
>> exactly the measures many take to fulfill their desires. None of these
>> circumstances are good. It results in more people in prison, more boys
>> abused, more lives destroyed.
>
>Let's repeat that: "It results in more people in prison, more boys
>abused, more lives destroyed."
>
>One more time: "It results in more people in prison, more boys abused,
>more lives destroyed."
>
>>
>> *********************
>>
>> Your opinions are solicited,
>>
>> Stay Safe,
>>
>> Doc
>>
>
>Now that I have made my comments, I will give Doc my opinion.
>Yet I am just a brainless troll unlike you humans who give some damn good
>points/comments/suggestions/life facts at times. You can go deep into the
>subject with your heart as you talk, or you may post shallow like I do.
I don't feel like what you have to say is shallow. I see a lot of
emotion in the words.
>Being a troll lets me hide from my lifestyle and my usenet past.
No one knows but you. Is it a burden you carry? If you ever need/want
to talk, perhaps I could be a sympathetic ear.
>My old posting nic is long gone. I have been busted twice and that's
>twice too many.
I hate to hear that. I agree, too many. Keep your nose clean and stay
safe.
>You see Doc, what your friend said is old news that keeps
>evolving. My usenet died years ago. My friends rot in prison. Many
>friends have died. Many friends left uesnet and found a life. They left
>out of fear - yes FEAR! And they also left because usenet groups were
>wasting away. If there is no one to talk to - and you cannot talk about
>the subject matter openly thanks to fuckin' pedo-hunters, you leave
>usenet for good, or go underground. look at the boy/girl support groups
>and think of bobandcarol, etc.
We are all we've got, GT. When we talk, perhaps it has to be enveilged
in some way. There is a way of saying what has to be said without
being specific. I will do what I can for you here. As will others like
4s00th. You know how to reach me, that method hasn't changed. We used
to be friends and we still should be. Remember a bunch of years ago
when someone posted what was purported to be my personal information?
I recently found out why that happened. There was/is another guy, in
another country with a similar name to mine. Apparently that guy was a
serial child abuser. Someone got onto me thinking I was him. Only
trouble was that I hadn't done any of the things that guy did. Funny
huh? No? You're right. We're not safe, even the 'good guys'.
>I could run my fuckin' mouth even more
>but I post in the open. Okay - one more to start a fight - I miss my
>friends like Darkshadows and ::Y-Not:: was my friend, and I loved
>asparagus and certain other groups. And there are some who lurk and post
>only when the moon is blue. Welcome back KidHacker!
>Okay. This time I say good-bye!
I hear you. I have a lot of MIA friends too. Remember Peter~Pan?
Remember Wally and Driving Junior? I still correspond with Ninja bless
his heart, but I sure would like to find Priest@TheOldTemple or Big
Red.
Life moves on and so do we. I still get to play with Tommy NP
sometimes and KidHacker's drop in was a welcome surprise. I miss Mephi
like nobody's business. But God gave me Victor Victorian. I miss MTB
and God gave me T-Bone and Mac. I miss Little Stinker and Anders and
God gave me BenDog and we still have Cosmos! Times are different. I
don't know that there was ever a character like IFB. He lives up to
his name, right? There are dozens of new friends to make. And by the
way, God gave me you too. So, as old timers, let's rekindle what was
and create a what-will-be. No need to say goodbye. We're just getting
started.
Love,
Doc
NP-f31
>
>SAFETY FIRST!
>
>USE X-No-Archive on every post you make!
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