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From: HMS Victor Victorian <VV@19thCent.net>
Newsgroups: alt.fan.utb.naughty-boy
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Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2007 02:45:00 GMT
Xref: news.nzbot.com alt.fan.utb.naughty-boy:165
X-Received-Date: Sat, 17 Oct 2009 17:34:08 UTC (s02-b06.iad)
On Thu, 28 Jun 2007 01:02:35 GMT, Dude With the Hair
<DudeWiththe(REMOVE)Hair@hushmail.com> wrote:
>On Wed, 27 Jun 2007 02:49:40 GMT, HMS Victor Victorian
><VV@19thCent.net> wrote:
>
>>On Wed, 27 Jun 2007 01:33:59 GMT, Dude With the Hair
>><DudeWiththe(REMOVE)Hair@hushmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 02:34:57 GMT, HMS Victor Victorian
>>><VV@19thCent.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>*Saving bandwidth*
>>>
>>>>>As for guidelines for intergenerational relationships, I can distill
>>>>>the right path down to one simple mantra:
>>>>>
>>>>>If we put our boys first in all things, then we will succeed in all of
>>>>>our goals for them.
>>>>>
>>>>>Thanks again The Non, for the thoughtful informative post.
>>>>>
>>>>>Doc
>>>>>NP-f31
>>>>>
>>>>>Boys First, Last and Always
>>>>
>>>>Taking your mantra to a logical extension ...
>>>>
>>>>Given the nature of Western Judeo-Christian society, a boylover who
>>>>has a consensual intimate relations with a young friend, however that
>>>>might be expressed, harms the boy through his own irresponsibility,
>>>>knowing that if the relationship is exposed, the boy could be
>>>>stigmatized by the very society that claims to protect his interests.
>>>>
>>>>This, then, is 4s00th's position.
>>>>
>>>>Is it yours?
>>>>Is it The Non's?
>>>
>>>In my practice and world view that scenario will have been thoroughly
>>>disscussed, debated and decided upon by both parties before any
>>>consenual act ever takes place. Given your example, you can see why I
>>>believe intergenerational sexual relationships should only be acted
>>>upon after months of eduation, thought and heartfelt discussion
>>>between partners who condider each other equals.
>>>
>>>Doc
>>>NP-f31
>>>
>>>>Most respectfully,
>>>>VV
>>>>God Save Her Majesty the Queen.
>>>>God Preserve the Prince of Wales.
>>>>Rule Britannia!
>>
>>
>>Yet, you must concede, my dear friend, that although a man and a boy
>>may have serious discussions regarding intimacy, and that the boy may
>>eagerly desire such intimacy, there is a real danger that should the
>>relationship "come out" in public, the boy will be stigmatized,
>>perhaps feel humiliation and suffer degredation--in other words, be
>>harmed.
>>
>>Let me tell you a story. I know of a boy, who was "involved" with a
>>man much older than he. Once an investigation was completed, the
>>older man went to prison for twenty years. The boy at the time of the
>>man's arrest was twelve or thirteen years old. By the time the trial
>>ended and the whole scenario became public, he was just entering
>>secondary.
>>
>>One morning, a passerby found him in a deep ravine, upon the rocks
>>below a highway bridge, dead. He had thrown himself off in an
>>attempt, tragically successful, to commit suicide. It was explained
>>to me that he had been so unmercifully taunted and degraded by his
>>school mates for being "so-and-so's wife" etc. that he had been driven
>>to self destruction.
>>
>>Is this outcome substantially the fault, then, of the man who loved
>>the boy and got caught?
>>
>>Respectfully submitted.
>
>No, that outcome was the results of kids being tough on other kids.
>And the real blame lies on the media who would publish the name of a
>minor in such a case. That should never have happened.
>
>Doc
>NP-f31
It seems peculiar to me that, during the course of this thread, I have
been alternating responses between you and The Non ... a tag team
endeavor, I suppose.
Let me address your second statement first. This event occurred in a
small, rural community, so to my knowledge the name of the minor was
never published. Don't delude yourself. Everyone at school knew.
Every kid knew who the older man was and which boys spent considerable
time with him. Many of those boys, among them the tragic suicide,
suffered the slings and arrows of their classmates being "tough" on
them. One boy, who was known as quite the tough, responded by beating
up his accuser. That ended his torment. The more sensitive and less
aggressive lads weren't so lucky and they certainly weren't spared.
Which brings me to your first statement. Why is it that makes "kids
being tough on other kids?" Although The Non has accused, and
rightfully so, the adult moral "authorities" of stigmatizing a boy, is
not the telling damage done not by them but by the boy's very
classmates, his peers and acquaintances? What is it that predisposes
kids to act in such an unsympathetic way as to drive a boy to suicide?
I can assure you it is a trait that many cultures do not share.
Is it not a deeper and broader malaise than merely the LEA, the
so-called psychologists, and the Media?
Thank you again, Doc, for your thought-provoking insight into these
matters.
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