Path: news.nzbot.com!not-for-mail
From: Bible Bob <biblebobnospam@biblebob.net>
Newsgroups: alt.fan.uncle-davey
Subject: Re: A riddle that was set me...
Reply-To: Bible Bob
Message-ID: <kmb8l1h2vis65fb2m996p0khuhlt8lpjee@4ax.com>
References: <dirgbm$qgf$0@pita.alt.net> <0tc4f.249987$084.245527@attbi_s22> <mvq2l153hhuegflas0f6vqs8f0kaor3trb@4ax.com> <8ph4f.441707$_o.160834@attbi_s71> <5jh3l1tfqin44ajg7jieudp341c1i68ned@4ax.com> <Php4f.490376$xm3.67136@attbi_s21> <3hq5l1hjkfu4ftnla2cq9i0rd19id0c178@4ax.com> <iKQ4f.254140$084.95063@attbi_s22>
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 2.0/32.652
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Lines: 80
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2005 23:08:25 GMT
NNTP-Posting-Host: 65.184.28.165
X-Complaints-To: abuse@rr.com
X-Trace: twister.southeast.rr.com 1129590505 65.184.28.165 (Mon, 17 Oct 2005 19:08:25 EDT)
NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2005 19:08:25 EDT
Organization: RoadRunner - Carolina
Xref: news.nzbot.com alt.fan.uncle-davey:4139
On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 16:57:50 GMT, Grinder <grinder@no.spam.maam.com>
wrote:
>Bible Bob wrote:
>> On Sun, 16 Oct 2005 09:44:15 GMT, Grinder <grinder@no.spam.maam.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Bible Bob wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Sun, 16 Oct 2005 00:45:56 GMT, Grinder <grinder@no.spam.maam.com>
>>>>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Allow me to break this conundrum down to its simplest form:
>>>>>
>>>>>Premises:
>>>>>
>>>>>1) Man has free will.
>>>>>
>>>>>2) God is omniscient.
>>>>>
>>>>>For a given decision, with two choices, A and B:
>>>>>
>>>>>3) God, being omniscient, knows the man will choose B.
>>>>>
>>>>>4) Man, has two choices:
>>>>>
>>>>> a) He freely chooses A, and shows God to be wrong,
>>>>> or *not* omniscient.
>>>>>
>>>>> b) He freely chooses B, as God knew he would all
>>>>> along.
>>>>>
>>>>>So here we are. There is *only one choice*, 4b, that
>>>>>can be made without violating Premise #2. If, however,
>>>>>man is not free to make either choice, that violoates
>>>>>Premise #1.
>>>>>
>>>>>Where is the flaw in this logic, or what is the means
>>>>>by which you can circumvent it?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Your premise fails to consider that man has free will but is not
>>>>omniscient.
>>>
>>>There is no premise that man is omniscient. What makes you think them
>>>I'm requiring that?
>>>
>>>
>>>>God is omniscient but can not act.
>>>
>>>Nor is there any premise that God must act -- only that He *knows*, in
>>>advance, how we will act.
>>
>>
>> Grinder,
>>
>> Exactly. God knows the possible choices and which choice will be made
>> but does not control the outcome. Man has choices; but not the way
>> you describe them. Man freely chooses A or B. God is right whether
>> man choses A or B because God knows whether man will chose A or B.
>> Man can not prove God wrong by his choices. God would have to predict
>> that that a specific man would do A and that specific man would have
>> to not do A for God to be wrong.
>
>Which of these premises are wrong?
>
>(1) Man may freely choose A or B.
>
>(2) God knows, in advance, what man will choose.
>
>(3) God cannot be wrong.
Grinder,
None. All three statements are true.
BB
http://www.biblebob.net
|
| Follow-ups: | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | 16 | 17 | 18 | 19 | 20 | 21 | 22 | 23 | 24 | 25 | 26 | 27 | 28 | 29 |
| 30 | 31 | 32 | 33 | 34 | 35 | 36 | 37 | 38 | 39 | 40 | 41 | 42 |
|