We all evolve all the time, and sometimes what we think the truth is,
flips sides, even back and forth... reality is complicated, and
deciding how to react to whatever it is we think we are seeing is also
subject to constant re-evaluation and re-consideration...
and thus, this morning, as I awoke, I found my mind in turmoil over
how I was responding to something. I mentioned yesterday that I had
started something, but didn't like how it was playing out, and used
the word "wordy" implying it was turning into a very long story, of
little benefit, either to you guys or to me, I'm sure. I'll leave it
intact below, and then proceed to explain the change of attitude and
heart.
On Fri, 01 Feb 2019 09:57:38 GMT, RIB <rib@rack.com> wrote:
>I was brought up to be a devout christian, receiving a church school education.
>It didn't take me as long as you to realize that creationism and science are
>not compatible. I was a confirmed atheist by the time I turned 17. I like and
>practice christian values but that's it for me.Spike and I will always lend you
>an ear if you feel the need :-) I'll take a look at that account if Spike isn't
>interested.
>
>RIB.
I'm not sure "good morrow" is a proper phrase, but my favorite version
of Romeo+Juliet was by Baz Luhrman, and my memory thinks that's
something I heard in the dialog... (nevermind, I'm talking out loud to
myself, i suppose, something i actually do all day, helps me think
since I'm continually having to solve puzzles and figure things out)
Thank you much for sharing about this... matter of fact, my experience
was very much the same as yours, except maybe it was 16 for me when I
would use the word "confirmed atheist" and yes, I ALWAYS believed
creationism was not compatible with sanity, much less science... and
like today, I was always an evangelist about it, writing essays and
passing them around in class to influence my fellow students... but a
funny thing happened, not amusing, but queer, on my way to
adulthood... too many long stories, but in short, well, hard to make
it too short and still make sense... i mentioned that i consider
myself a philosopher, even from childhood, but especially as a teen,
reading books and trying to figure out reality and existence. While I
was still going to church, maybe 14 or so, they showed the youth group
a film about drugs, and I immediately wanted to get some LSD once I
knew about it, but i didn't know anybody outside my church friends,
and drugs were not around at all at that time, but it wouldnt be many
years before it was avaliable. heroin never was appealing, even if it
had been free... anyhow, i loved acid. I didn't do it a huge number
of times, maybe 20? maybe less, it was weird and crazy and i loved
the
-------------- end of what i had written previously
It is complicated how we make up and change our minds, and for years,
since becoming an atheist, I have blamed my teenage drug use for
softening my thinking, but it's much more complex when I think about
it. Not to make this a long story either, but it was a host of
influences that were "in the air" so to speak, when I started college.
There were all different kinds of religious cults popping up all over
the place, so while I hated the deadness of the church I had been
raised in, and never considered the fundy-creationist churches...
well, let's say I was biased against christianity, and saw it as
hypocrisy and fraud, and was leaning towards eastern mysticism for a
while, considering re-incarnation... anyway, all the different
philosophies I studied and interacted with would speak highly of Jesus
as a great master, so it was possible to think of him apart from the
churches that claimed to represent him.
Problem is, not to blame drugs, but just the fact that I'm somewhat
naieve and trusting, as I'm a very honest type, and tend to believe
others when they seem to be speaking honestly. many long stories
later, yada yada, and one night I came to a mental crossroads. I
hated this experience called life, as we live in a dark reality of
frauds and liars and greed and wicked insanity and cruelty, yada yada,
and life is so unpredictably short no matter how long you live, death
is waiting... since everyone seemed to think so highly of Jesus, that
while I hated christianity, I saw Jesus as my most likely path to
enlightenment, "cosmic consciousness" or whatever it was... I still
was believing in reincarnation at the time, but decided to start
reading the Bible again and to give Jesus 100% of myself, as opposed
to flipping between different views of reality, as I had been doing
for a couple of years. long stories again, but that lead me into the
perfect cult for me, one that actually understood and practiced what
Jesus preached, as much that is possible in today's world, or rather,
the world of the middle 1970's, when cults were everywhere, moonies,
hari-krishnas, etc... the point of all this was that I got distracted
by things, consumed by things, and overlooked the creationist issue,
as the cult I had joined was very pro-science in its understanding,
and very pro-truth and hatred of falsehood, so it was like I had found
my own kind, after years of being all alone in my understandings...
except that it wasn't quite like that, I just thought it was...
because it was, partly, but only on the surface... so if only
someone had challenged me about the creationist issue, they could have
saved me 35 years of stupidity, but that never happened, because
nobody much cares about real truth and real reverence to propagate it
and attack all false ways... because..... because... So here's the
change of heart and mind that I awoke with:
Rib, you describe yourself as an atheist who likes and practices what
you call "christian values"... My first reaction was to agree with
you somehow, and say I am the same way, because I do claim that now,
that I am an atheist who still follows the way of Jesus, a dead man.
But I know the Bible intimately, having read it cover to cover several
times and studied it in detail for decades...
but that's not at all what you mean by "christian values."
I don't know what you mean, specifically, because all christians on
all sides would say the same words and mean opposing things, like one
group thinks homosexuality should be illegal, if not a capital crime,
as the Bible teaches. Slavery is also acceptable in the christian
bible.
Another group thinks it's okay to be homosexual, but still claims it
is their chrsitian values that motivate their thinking... So rather
than try to agree with you on the surface, and try to influence you to
see my rendition of what true christian values must be, according to
Jesus's teachings, or my understanding of those teachings... I've
been down that road too many times... rather, I should challenge you
to explain and defend exactly what you mean by that, because almost
certainly, I could demonstrate to you, if you would listen, how you
have been deceived by proganda and falsehood into substituting
bullshit into what you think are the values promoted by Jesus.
Thus christian values is the white-wash that hides gross wickedness
under a cloak of respectability...
So my minds says that I must challenge you, except that I can almost
guarantee that you wouldn't be interested, because you like your life
the way it is, and who cares anyway, life is short, you dont need my
"truth" as your truth is true enough for you... and that kind of
interaction is what I've been thru a zillioin times, after pouring
myself out with long explanations trying to prove this or that to
someone not interested in my boring waddle of words and biblical
teachings...
does that make sense? i dont say this to offend you, but i always
seem to offend everyone, once I start explaining anything specific to
anyone in particular, who reverences their pride and esteem more than
cold unflattering truth... truth, huh, what is it good for! (misquote
from a song about "war")
thus my isolation, and solitude, to prevent wasting myself on deaf
ears...
so Spike, i'm sorry to be such a flake, but think i should just bail
out now, unsubscribe and forget this whole chapter of my life, and
keep the account i mentioned for future downloads... :(
what can i say. i'm sorry. life still sux...
I wont disconnect today, and will gladly wait to read any responses,
but it's cool if you dont want to bother making any. I need to
re-read Spike's last message, as there may be other things I want to
respond to, but this is it for today.
i still like you guys and apprecaite all the ways you helped me along
the way and for all the content you posted, that i still have not
watched, but may eventually, if i live long enuff...
peace and love be with you,
and Spike, I hope you can survive long enough to find other pleasures
to help you abandon the nasty tobacco fix for a more healthy fix...
but to each his/her own
blessings to you both, not that blesing are worth much, but it's the
thought that counts, supposedly.
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